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Post by GTS on Sept 20, 2018 1:17:10 GMT -7
I was very impressed with the video from Kiwidave's International Meet showing the staging of the cars. I'm just a few days away from re-routing a new track and beings the timing software I use has hookups for dual staging sensors, I thought I'd go ahead and fabricate accordingly. If I ever actually use them will be another story entirely but would like to allow for them.
So, here is the question; What is the accepted distance of the staging sensors to the start sensors?
I'm thinkin' .2" or there abouts but really don't have a clue. Is there an established full scale distance that anyone knows of that I could scale down?
As always, any and all input is greatly appreciated. Thanks, Gale
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Post by AJR on Sept 20, 2018 2:55:55 GMT -7
I am running a Trackmate DP3000HO timing system which utilizes infra red sensors. They recommend 1/2" between pre stage and stage. I stage my cars manually though, I do not bump them in. I do not have a problem with controller staging since it replicates real drag racing, but manually staging and activating the tree/timing system manually works best for me since I am by myself a lot of the time. I'm looking forward to the next version of your track.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 20, 2018 4:22:06 GMT -7
be sure to understand that the Slot Dragon system has only one sensor per lane for staging and Reaction Time and beginning Elapsed Timing.
the RT is measured from the time the green light comes on until the car clears the sensor and light hits it.
similarly, the ET begins when the light hits the sensor after the car clears off it.
so, the staging distance is the length of a car and bumping them into stage is easier.
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Post by GTS on Sept 20, 2018 6:57:50 GMT -7
I am running a Trackmate DP3000HO timing system which utilizes infra red sensors. They recommend 1/2" between pre stage and stage. I stage my cars manually though, I do not bump them in. I do not have a problem with controller staging since it replicates real drag racing, but manually staging and activating the tree/timing system manually works best for me since I am by myself a lot of the time. I'm looking forward to the next version of your track. Thanks Jeff! Gonna go with the 1/2" spacing. I'm sure I'll be doing the manual staging also 99.9% of the time. The consideration of including it is due to the interest generated by the various HVAC personnel that have been here doing tear out and installation of equipment. They will need to come back to finish the install once the utilities department run the gas line in to the property from the alley and set up the meter on Thursday of next week. After final installation there will be a final inspection. So looking at a "full speed ahead" on track construction in about 2 weeks  . At least now I know what is going on for sure in the basement so can do a lot more preliminary work.
Thanks alpink for your response.
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Post by dave632 on Sept 21, 2018 8:52:15 GMT -7
1/2" is a pretty good distance for staging of the HO cars. Personally I manually stage all the cars, especially since many of the races are decided by
thousandths a small advantage at the start can make the difference at the finish. In 1/1 there is only 7" between stage lights and even that can be manipulated
in certain circumstances. Reaction time is distorted by the length of the car in HO racing as the back end of the car starts the timer. A longer car such as
a dragster will have a slower reaction time because of this. This is corrected once the car hits the 60' time as the longer car will then have a quicker 60' time
because of it's longer length and the way the timer is started. In 1/1 the timer is started as soon as the car leaves the first beam so there is no such effect there.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 21, 2018 10:43:22 GMT -7
I think the Track Mate system, when set up for one stage sensor, begins the ET when the car breaks the next sensor.
that is the selection I have. so the car is fully staged when the first sensor is covered.
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Post by dave632 on Sept 21, 2018 12:23:24 GMT -7
Thanks Al, I noticed they have a second staging option, called guard beam, on the Track Mate system which is the one I believe you are mentioning and I have never tried. I am going to try that selection as I think it will give more accurate 60' times.
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Post by AJR on Sept 21, 2018 13:53:16 GMT -7
I think the Track Mate system, when set up for one stage sensor, begins the ET when the car breaks the next sensor. that is the selection I have. so the car is fully staged when the first sensor is covered. That is also how I have mine set up as well. The cars are staged by covering the first sensor and the timer starts when the car breaks the beam on the second sensor. Definitely a better reaction time and also more realistic. And yes I believe there are different ways to set that up in the Trackmate Sytem. |
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Post by dave632 on Sept 21, 2018 17:23:56 GMT -7
Changed to the guard beam setting, the reaction and 60' times are much more consistent. The length of the car makes no difference now. If I can just remember not to cover both beams now.
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Post by GTS on Sept 23, 2018 7:00:08 GMT -7
Just an FYI; I'm not certain of the staging operation in the software that I use (Drag Race Coordinator) because previously I had opted to turn the staging off. Once I get the track re-done I will update. The software itself, has been updated, so now will be able to have sensors for pre stage, stage, start, 60', 330', 660', speed trap & finish. Pretty excited about getting all of that dialed in . |
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Post by dave632 on Sept 23, 2018 8:18:01 GMT -7
It is good to have all the incremental times as you can see where the car is doing well or not so well.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 23, 2018 8:49:35 GMT -7
Just an FYI; I'm not certain of the staging operation in the software that I use (Drag Race Coordinator) because previously I had opted to turn the staging off. Once I get the track re-done I will update. The software itself, has been updated, so now will be able to have sensors for pre stage, stage, start, 60', 330', 660', speed trap & finish. Pretty excited about getting all of that dialed in . -------------- are you saying that your system has three sensors per lane for the starting line? pre stage ( one stage bulb lit) stage (two stage bulbs lit) start = measure reaction time, begin timing ET and register foul (red light) if necessary ? that is how the Trik Trax Drag Trax systems stage. they are very old school, but some folks are still using them. |
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Post by GTS on Sept 23, 2018 10:15:37 GMT -7
Just an FYI; I'm not certain of the staging operation in the software that I use (Drag Race Coordinator) because previously I had opted to turn the staging off. Once I get the track re-done I will update. The software itself, has been updated, so now will be able to have sensors for pre stage, stage, start, 60', 330', 660', speed trap & finish. Pretty excited about getting all of that dialed in . -------------- are you saying that your system has three sensors per lane for the starting line? pre stage ( one stage bulb lit) stage (two stage bulbs lit) start = measure reaction time, begin timing ET and register foul (red light) if necessary ? that is how the Trik Trax Drag Trax systems stage. they are very old school, but some folks are still using them. Yes. It will be capable of that. Not that it matters, Al, but curious what determines all of that as being old school?
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Post by Deleted on Sept 23, 2018 17:58:55 GMT -7
well, not really old school. the timing system I mention is ancient (not the idea of 3 sensors per lane for the starting line), no longer being produced or maintained.
it is a special built stand alone computer with the best technology available for it's time.
my buddy Hank has one of my old ones. I have owned 5 altogether at different times for 1/24 drag strips and 1/64 drag strips.
basically Track Mate doesn't have 3 sensors on the starting line and I know of no other currently available drag timing systems that do. .....
until now.
thank you for sharing.
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Post by dave632 on Sept 23, 2018 18:48:13 GMT -7
My Track Mate has 2 sensors for staging. I am now using the first beam to light both stage lights, this is called the guard beam setting. Then the next beam starts the timer, it is by far the more accurate setting for 60' times as with the stage and pre stage setting the rear of the car starts the timers. This would greatly distort the 60' and reaction times. 1/1 tracks have 2 beams 7" apart. When you leave the 2nd beam the timer starts.
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. At least now I know what is going on for sure in the basement so can do a lot more preliminary work.
